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petrol ?

Last post 08-12-2009 09:22 PM by wleung. 32 replies.
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  • 08-10-2009 05:44 PM In reply to

    • 15UZU
    • Top 25 Contributor
    • Joined on 01-08-2009
    • Slacks Creek, QLD
    • Posts 1,140

    Re: petrol ?

    Ok....to give you an analogy you can work with - instead of having to get a points dizzy regraphed the ECU can adjust the spark advance on the fly depending on the information it receives from sensors such as EGO, Knock, CAS, Temp, Water Temp, MAP/MAF & TPS.

    If the ECU gets a high oxygen signal from the EGO in the exhaust, and the TPS is reading WOT then the ECU wil increase the injector duty cycle to inject more fuel into the cylinder. If however the TPS was reading closed then it wouldn't (thinking the vehcle is coasting). Similarly, the ECU will constantly check the signal from the Knock sensor and advance the spark timing until it sense the onset of detonation & then dial it back. It's this ability that lets some (but not all) ECU controlled engines self optimise for the fuel that is being used.



    2010 PGO X-Hot 150cc - clocking up the kays
    2006 Vmoto Monza 50cc - to be rebuilt......I wonder if I can get this TMAX 500 engine in here??? o_O
    2005 Vmoto Monza 50cc - in the rebuild phase
    2002 Aprilia SR50 50cc - currently out on loan
  • 08-10-2009 06:09 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

     Last year in QLD i had to use E10 in the car each time i got about 70 to 80 ks less out of a tank its to my mind not economical to use over 91 regular 

    Si ‘Thi’ later
  • 08-10-2009 06:12 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

     yes that totally makes sense I5uzu now ive got it

     

    still fuel injection with sensors is *** heheaha

     

     

     

    its all in the timing man all in the timing  Wink

    dont get struck by a truck
  • 08-10-2009 06:25 PM In reply to

    • 15UZU
    • Top 25 Contributor
    • Joined on 01-08-2009
    • Slacks Creek, QLD
    • Posts 1,140

    Re: petrol ?

    pyrah:

     Last year in QLD i had to use E10 in the car each time i got about 70 to 80 ks less out of a tank its to my mind not economical to use over 91 regular 

    Yes , that is one of the disadvantages of Ethanol - it's BTU rating is less than that of petrol, so the percentage that is replaced in the blend holds less energy therefore meaning you have to use more fuel to produce the same power output. There are definitely pros & cons to each fuel, but if you have to run a tank or two of E10 because it's all that is available, then it's good to know that your engine can safely use it. Wink

     



    2010 PGO X-Hot 150cc - clocking up the kays
    2006 Vmoto Monza 50cc - to be rebuilt......I wonder if I can get this TMAX 500 engine in here??? o_O
    2005 Vmoto Monza 50cc - in the rebuild phase
    2002 Aprilia SR50 50cc - currently out on loan
  • 08-10-2009 06:41 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    my head is sore from scratching why cant we go back to super/leaded and carbies

    carbies rule/ fuel injection sucks from the do it yerself point of view

    dont get struck by a truck
  • 08-10-2009 06:51 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    I won't use ethanol because none of my scooter's engines are designed to cope with it. All two-strokes with carbies and some iron parts.

    Quote is from link below:

    "Ethanol corrodes iron parts slightly, and shouldn't be used in any vehicle not designed for use with ethanol, especially E85."

    http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_are_some_pros_and_cons_of_ethanol

    organiser Hobart Motor Scooter Club

    Cool gear and Vespa seat covers at cosmicbreed.com

    For info on the National Scooter Rallies open to all riders, go to National Scooter Rally

    Remember, don't spend all your time posting on scooter forums - get out there and ride your scooter...
  • 08-10-2009 06:56 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    Big Smile And while where at it lets go back to points as well cant trust that modern electronic ignition  Big Smile  

    Si ‘Thi’ later
  • 08-10-2009 07:22 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    As it happens, all but one of my scooters do still run on points, no pesky battery to worry about! Big Smile

    organiser Hobart Motor Scooter Club

    Cool gear and Vespa seat covers at cosmicbreed.com

    For info on the National Scooter Rallies open to all riders, go to National Scooter Rally

    Remember, don't spend all your time posting on scooter forums - get out there and ride your scooter...
  • 08-10-2009 08:36 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    spoons

    dont get struck by a truck
  • 08-10-2009 11:49 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

     Well let me see if the points are set wrong the timing will be out with means you wont be igniting the fuel at the optimum time so your fuel is not being used efficiently

    Si ‘Thi’ later
  • 08-11-2009 06:44 AM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    Thanks Sharon,

    I normally run 95 in the PX but had only a little loose change in my pocket the other day and so went El Cheapo 91 to get me home. (nearest servo is a 10 km round trip).

    My mind is now at ease that I'm looking after my pride and joy as well as I can.Smile

    "Vespista" is not actually Italian slang for a drunken Vespa rider.
  • 08-11-2009 10:47 AM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    joshzingzing:
    carbies rule/ fuel injection sucks from the do it yerself point of view
     

    EFI is a system incorporating more than just an injector squirting in fuel. For the DIY modder its great unless you are going hardcore with your mods.

    www.scooterhq.com.au

    Where the scooters roam free
  • 08-11-2009 01:58 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    joshzingzing:

     yes that totally makes sense I5uzu now ive got it

     

    still fuel injection with sensors is *** heheaha

     

    and i cant see why silverflyer god bless hehehaha can say his is fuel injected so i have to run premium

     

    its all in the timing man all in the timing  Wink

     

    i am runing engine built in europe where the basic fuel is 95ron. i get better fuel economy from 95- 98 ron petrol. it is easier to upjet a carby and change timing instead of remapping a ecu.

    a carby engined scooter can be run on 91ron petrol easier than a efi engine.

    i didn't say you had to run yours on premium. i said mine are run on premium petrol. when filling a 11 -12 litre tank the price difference is minimal.

    argentum melle
  • 08-11-2009 06:51 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

     

    i dont know whats going on now ,but silverflyer im deffinetly not going to say a carby engine doesnt need premium grade fuel just because its not made in europe and just because its not fuel injected

    and i deffinatly wont say a fuel injected car made in europe needs a 95 or higher octane just because its european and FI ........ that would just be bullshit

     

    for example i drive a late model toyota hilux at work that is fuel injected it runs very well on the cheapest and lowest octane fuel money can buy

    and i have a suzuki sierra in the carport that is carby and will not run properly on anything other than premium grade fuel no matter how much i mess with the timing it simply needs 95 or higher octane to run properly

    while neither of my comparisons are scooters im just saying fuel injection makes didly squat difference to engine timing-------- in the most simplistic way possible

    dont get struck by a truck
  • 08-12-2009 05:22 PM In reply to

    Re: petrol ?

    joshzingzing:

     

    i dont know whats going on now ,but silverflyer im deffinetly not going to say a carby engine doesnt need premium grade fuel just because its not made in europe and just because its not fuel injected

    and i deffinatly wont say a fuel injected car made in europe needs a 95 or higher octane just because its european and FI ........ that would just be bullshit

     

    for example i drive a late model toyota hilux at work that is fuel injected it runs very well on the cheapest and lowest octane fuel money can buy

    and i have a suzuki sierra in the carport that is carby and will not run properly on anything other than premium grade fuel no matter how much i mess with the timing it simply needs 95 or higher octane to run properly

    while neither of my comparisons are scooters im just saying fuel injection makes didly squat difference to engine timing-------- in the most simplistic way possible

    true. fuel injection will have feulling maps to cope with low grade fuel. all i am saying is that 95 ron petrol is the basic fuel in europe. so the car/ bike companies manufacturing there will spend a large amount of  r&d to work on that type of fuel.

    or i am talking a load of crap.

    use whatever fuel you like.

    argentum melle
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