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List of E Scooters

Last post 07-29-2015 09:34 PM by vortexau. 94 replies.
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  • 06-25-2015 12:10 PM In reply to

    • vortexau
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 10-25-2008
    • Plainland Q, on the Warrego Hwy
    • Posts 462

    Re: List of E Scooters

    ferrix:

    pyrah:

    ferrix:

    jimscoot:

    Just think of the savings..no rego no insurance no fuel no servicing costs. Add that all up you will have it paid off in no time!!!

    Still, it is not road legal. I wouldn't invest - what, something like 5 grand? - into something that has to rely on cops being in the good mood when you run into them..

     

    Try nearly 10 grand that's the asking price in SA Sad

    That's just silly! You could buy a proper scooter for around 5 grand and the other 5 would pay rego, insurance and fuel for the next 5 years.

    Horses for courses! A "proper scooter" (as you put it) whatever the price would be a poor choice of mount if the prospective rider wanted to become airbourne off ramps and mounds, and employ his/her legs to encorporate physical exercise into the outing.

    One might as well be critizing the possibility of a pilot paying big money for a sophisicated (and expensive) high-altitude glider when a cheap many-former-owner Cessna 172 would present less of a drain on financial resources.

    __________________
    Marty McFly:
    Does it run like on, on regular unleaded gasoline?
    Dr. Emmett L. Brown:
    Unfortunately, no. It requires something with a little more kick . . . plutonium!
  • 06-25-2015 01:00 PM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    My prediction is thata small amount of E scooters will be sold ,mainly in the bigger cities to people who just need cheap easy trasport to get to work etc

    I doubt if any of us can forsee E sccoters going on rides like Pete and Eccles do or in country locations

    I have had members tell me of seeing people pushing their E scooters in Asian cities because their batteries were flat

    Unless a network of battery charging places were established and the charging time reduced to say 5 minutes then I for one wouldnt be buying a E Scooter

     

    riding for fun
  • 06-26-2015 01:00 PM In reply to

    • vortexau
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 10-25-2008
    • Plainland Q, on the Warrego Hwy
    • Posts 462

    Re: List of E Scooters

    Rod Fountain:

    My prediction is thata small amount of E scooters will be sold ,mainly in the bigger cities to people who just need cheap easy trasport to get to work etc

    I doubt if any of us can forsee E sccoters going on rides like Pete and Eccles do or in country locations

    I have had members tell me of seeing people pushing their E scooters in Asian cities because their batteries were flat

    Unless a network of battery charging places were established and the charging time reduced to say 5 minutes then I for one wouldnt be buying a E Scooter

     

    25 famous predictions that were proven to be horribly wrong. Embarrassed

    25-  "There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will ever be obtainable. It would mean that the atom would have to be shattered at will." – Albert Einstein, 1932

    24-  "We don't like their sound, and guitar music is on the way out." – Decca Recording Company on declining to sign the Beatles, 1962

    23-  "This 'telephone' has too many shortcomings to be seriously considered as a means of communication. The device is inherently of no value to us." – Western Union internal memo, 1876

    22-  "Reagan doesn't have that presidential look." – United Artists executive after rejecting Reagan as lead in the 1964 film The Best Man

    21-  "Rail travel at high speed is not possible because passengers, unable to breathe, would die of asphyxia." – Dr. Dionysius Lardner, 1830

    20-  "I think there is a world market for maybe five computers." – Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

    19-  "X-rays will prove to be a hoax." – Lord Kelvin, President of the Royal Society, 1883

    18-  "Everyone acquainted with the subject will recognize it as a conspicuous failure." – -Henry Morton, president of the Stevens Institute of Technology, on Edison's light bulb, 1880

    17-  "The horse is here to stay but the automobile is only a novelty—a fad." – -The president of the Michigan Savings Bank advising Henry Ford's lawyer not to invest in the Ford Motor Co., 1903

    16-  "Television won't last because people will soon get tired of staring at a plywood box every night." – -Darryl Zanuck, movie producer, 20th Century Fox, 1946

    15-  "No one will pay good money to get from Berlin to Potsdam in one hour when he can ride his horse there in one day for free." – King William I of Prussia, on trains, 1864

    14-  "There is no reason for any individual to have a computer in his home." – -Ken Olson, president, chairman and founder of Digital Equipment Corporation (DEC), in a talk given to a 1977 World Future Society meeting in Boston

    13-  "If excessive smoking actually plays a role in the production of lung cancer, it seems to be a minor one." – -W.C. Heuper, National Cancer Institute, 1954

    12-   "No, it will make war impossible." – -Hiram Maxim, inventor of the machine gun, in response to the question "Will this gun not make war more terrible?" from Havelock Ellis, an English scientist, 1893

    11-  "The wireless music box has no imaginable commercial value. Who would pay for a message sent to no one in particular?" – -Associates of David Sarnoff responding to the latter's call for investment in the radio in 1921

    10-  "There will never be a bigger plane built." – – A Boeing engineer, after the first flight of the 247, a twin engine plane that holds ten people

    (While the A380-800 is certified for up to 853 passengers (538 on the main deck and 315 on the upper), achievable with a one-class configuration, Airbus references a "comfortable three-class" 525-passenger configuration in their marketing material however few airlines have configured A380s with that many seats.)



    9-   "How, sir, would you make a ship sail against the wind and currents by lighting a bonfire under her deck? I pray you, excuse me, I have not the time to listen to such nonsense.” — Napoleon Bonaparte, when told of Robert Fulton’s steamboat, 1800s

    8-   “The idea that cavalry will be replaced by these iron coaches is absurd. It is little short of treasonous.” — Comment of Aide-de-camp to Field Marshal Haig, at tank demonstration, 1916

    7-   "I must confess that my imagination refuses to see any sort of submarine doing anything but suffocating its crew and floundering at sea.” — HG Wells, British novelist, in 1901

    6-   "The world potential market for copying machines is 5000 at most.” — IBM, to the eventual founders of Xerox, saying the photocopier had no market large enough to justify production, 1959

    5-   “The Americans have need of the telephone, but we do not. We have plenty of messenger boys.” — Sir William Preece, Chief Engineer, British Post Office, 1878

    4-   "It'll be gone by June." – Variety Magazine on Rock n' Roll, 1955

    3-   "And for the tourist who really wants to get away from it all, safaris in Vietnam" – -Newsweek, predicting popular holidays for the late 1960s.

    2-   “When the Paris Exhibition [of 1878] closes, electric light will close with it and no more will be heard of it.” – Oxford professor Erasmus Wilson

    1-   A rocket will never be able to leave the Earth’s atmosphere.” — New York Times, 1936

    __________________
    Marty McFly:
    Does it run like on, on regular unleaded gasoline?
    Dr. Emmett L. Brown:
    Unfortunately, no. It requires something with a little more kick . . . plutonium!
  • 06-26-2015 01:29 PM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    vortexau:

    20-  "I think there is a world market for maybe five computers." – Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

    That one is just an urban myth, apparently - there is no evidence of Thomas Watson actually saying any such thing.

    3-   "And for the tourist who really wants to get away from it all, safaris in Vietnam" – -Newsweek, predicting popular holidays for the late 1960s.

    They might've been slightly ahead of their time, but Vietnam is certainly a popular tourist destination now...

     

  • 06-26-2015 01:34 PM In reply to

    • vortexau
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 10-25-2008
    • Plainland Q, on the Warrego Hwy
    • Posts 462

    Re: List of E Scooters

    ferrix:

    They might've been slightly ahead of their time, but Vietnam is certainly a popular tourist destination now...

    Well, if you re-visit that prediction you may notice that 2015 was not mentioned, but the late 60s was.

    In 1968 I turned 18 and let me inform you that neither myself nor acquaintances of a similar age formed any intent of visiting Vietnam as a civilian between 1966 and 1975.  In fact wars had been raging in that area since early 1956!

    (NB- So, your big take on a list of 25 poor predictions is to try to demolish two of those examples?)

    Then, considering prediction number seven (submarines) and the achievement of Australia's second naval submarine 100 years ago:

    AE2 was towed to the Mediterranean, and arrived off Egypt in early 1915. The boat was assigned to the Dardanelles Campaign,  and was the first submarine to successfully penetrate the waterway and enter the Sea of Marmara.  (This was after British submarines had failed to make any real progress through this waterway.)  With orders to "run amok" inside Turkish territory, AE2 operated for five days before mechanical faults forced her to the surface, where she was damaged by the torpedo boat Sultanhisar. The submarine was scuttled by her crew, all of whom were captured.

    Adding the fact that German Uboats (which nearly brought Britian to her knees in WWII) and which were propelled underwater by battery-electric motive power, before the arrival of the air-breathing snorkel made it possible to use the diesels while submerged at periscope depth and the further appearance of the experimental Walter turbine with Hydrogen peroxide as fuel showing potential in a high speed & endurance propulsion independent from surface air.

    snorkel

     . . may it not be considered foolhardy to predict that electric-powered motor scooters will forever be hampered by very short range?

    __________________
    Marty McFly:
    Does it run like on, on regular unleaded gasoline?
    Dr. Emmett L. Brown:
    Unfortunately, no. It requires something with a little more kick . . . plutonium!
  • 06-26-2015 03:34 PM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    vortexau:

    Well, if you re-visit that prediction you may notice that 2015 was not mentioned, but the late 60s was.

    That's why I said they were slightly ahead of their time. Not in the 60s, but their prediction did come true eventually. In that it is rather like the electric powered vehicles, actually - their proponents have been promising for years now breaktrough in battery technology is just around the corner... and we're still waiting... and they are still just around the corner. Any day now. Mind you, I'm not saying that will never happen - but they are taking their time. ESPECIALLY considering electricity and internal combustion started out head to head, lack of progress on the electric side is rather remarkable.

     

     

     

     

  • 06-26-2015 04:01 PM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    Devil In the 70s i served on nuclear submarines and we dived and stayed underwater for 3 or more months at a time . No snorkel electrolysers & co2 scrubbers to keep us breathing . So steam power/electric must be the best form of sustained propulsion  Geeked

  • 06-26-2015 06:23 PM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    pyrah:

    Devil In the 70s i served on nuclear submarines and we dived and stayed underwater for 3 or more months at a time .

     

    Do you glow in the dark? :)

     

  • 06-26-2015 07:39 PM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    ferrix:

    pyrah:

    Devil In the 70s i served on nuclear submarines and we dived and stayed underwater for 3 or more months at a time .

     

    Do you glow in the dark? :)

     

    Wink Only when urinating Stick out tongue

     

  • 06-27-2015 12:46 AM In reply to

    • vortexau
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 10-25-2008
    • Plainland Q, on the Warrego Hwy
    • Posts 462

    Re: List of E Scooters

    ferrix:

    vortexau:

    Well, if you re-visit that prediction you may notice that 2015 was not mentioned, but the late 60s was.

    That's why I said they were slightly ahead of their time. Not in the 60s, but their prediction did come true eventually. In that it is rather like the electric powered vehicles, actually - their proponents have been promising for years now breaktrough in battery technology is just around the corner... and we're still waiting... and they are still just around the corner. Any day now. Mind you, I'm not saying that will never happen - but they are taking their time. ESPECIALLY considering electricity and internal combustion started out head to head, lack of progress on the electric side is rather remarkable.

    Hmmm!  You do not seem to want to acknowledge when you make that last statement that although "electricity and internal combustion started out" in a common period of history, they do not share the same continuous attention by development engineers!?!

    Indeed, steam power predated both electricity and internal combustion by its appearance in 1768 by builder Nicolas-Joseph Cugnot.

    Steam-powered automobiles continued development all the way into the early 20th century, but the dissemination of petrol engines as the motive power of choice in the late 19th century marked the end of steam automobiles except as curiosities. (From Wikipedia, The History of the automobile)

    Electric cars enjoyed popularity between the late 19th century and early 20th century, when electricity was among the preferred methods for automobile propulsion, providing a level of comfort and ease of operation that could not be achieved by the gasoline cars of the time. Advances in internal combustion technology, especially the electric starter, soon rendered this advantage moot; the greater range of gasoline cars, quicker refueling times, and growing petroleum infrastructure, along with the mass production of gasoline vehicles by companies such as the Ford Motor Company, which reduced prices of gasoline cars to less than half that of equivalent electric cars, led to a decline in the use of electric propulsion, effectively removing it from important markets such as the United States by the 1930s.(From Wikipedia, The History of the automobile)

    So, it would appear that there is a 55-60 year gap until we next see electric automobile propulsion next make a failed reappearance in the late-1990s through General Motors with their EV1 "which was made available for lease mainly in Southern California"?

    (suggested viewing "Who killed the electric car?")

    A portion of the film details GM's efforts to demonstrate to California that there was no consumer demand for their product, and then to take back every EV1 and destroy them. A few were disabled and given to museums and universities, but almost all were found to have been crushed. GM never responded to the EV drivers' offer to pay the residual lease value.

    The film explores some of the motives that may have pushed the auto and oil industries to kill off the electric car.  Wally Rippel offers, for example, that the oil companies were afraid of losing their monopoly on transportation fuel over the coming decades; while the auto companies feared short term costs for EV development and long term revenue loss because EVs require little maintenance and no tuneups. Others explained the killing differently. GM spokesman Dave Barthmuss argued it was lack of consumer interest due to the maximum range of 80–100 miles per charge, and the relatively high price.
    The film also showed the failed attempts by electric car enthusiasts trying to combat auto industry moves, and save the surviving vehicles.
    (From Wikipedia, The History of the automobile)

    Its not difficult to form an conclusion that, if a major concern like GM showed such opposition to having any part in late 20th century EV development, it just may be that Ford and Chrysler also lacked any real interest as well.  These three are often referred to as the "Big Three," being the largest automakers in the United States and Canada.

    My conclusion is that with such opposition by major players in the automobile field, and with a 55-60 year gap during the interval when most auto builders were not only developing the gasoline & diesel engines, but also re-tooling for massive production in the war period 1939-1945, so it is hardly surprising that internal combustion shows a hugh lead and amount of progress!?!?

    What is more remarkable is that YOU ignore factors that make internal combustion vs electric power in the field of personal transportation a very uneven playing field in the design and improvement aspects.

     ......................................................................................................................

    There are many surprises in western transportation history.  The jet engine was independently initially conceived in The United States of America, Italy, the United Kingdom, and Germany.  German jet engines in WWII displayed the highest developed thrust figures, while English jet engines were able to run for longer periods (a factor of at least ten, compared to German engines) between overhauls.

    In the USA, despite their hugh industrial base, jet engines were displaying such inferior developed thrust & run times that England shipped production Whittle-built jet engines (at the request of Vannevar Bush) along with blueprints so that arrangements could be made to produce the British engine in the United States by finding a suitable company.

    US air forces (including the Marines) rarely procured foreign-designed aircraft.  But see

    Martin B-57 Canberra - From Wikipedia

    __________________
    Marty McFly:
    Does it run like on, on regular unleaded gasoline?
    Dr. Emmett L. Brown:
    Unfortunately, no. It requires something with a little more kick . . . plutonium!
  • 06-27-2015 01:51 AM In reply to

    • vortexau
    • Top 75 Contributor
    • Joined on 10-25-2008
    • Plainland Q, on the Warrego Hwy
    • Posts 462

    Re: List of E Scooters

    pyrah:

    Devil In the 70s i served on nuclear submarines and we dived and stayed underwater for 3 or more months at a time . No snorkel electrolysers & co2 scrubbers to keep us breathing . So steam power/electric must be the best form of sustained propulsion  Geeked

     

     

    "Best form of sustained propulsion" isn't always the preferred option.  Cost also can be a factor to consider.

    Oct 18, 2011- "
    In recent months there have been a number of calls for building diesel-powered submarines for the United States Navy. In two separate Defense News articles in June and September Gary Schmitt and J. Scott Shipman, respectively, urged the Navy to build such vessels. They cite a number of advantages for diesel subs, both operationally and in terms of cost.

    They both note that one of the biggest challenges facing the Navy today – and one which it will continue to face in the coming years – is a lack of submarines in sufficient numbers to maintain a presence in areas of interest to the United States.

    As Schmitt and Shipman note, the cost of a Virginia-class submarine is in the area of $2 billion, whereas the cost of a diesel boat is around $500 million. Given these prices, the U.S. Navy could certainly procure more submarines (and have a correspondingly greater presence around the world) if it pursued diesel instead of nuclear versions.

    Diesel-Electric Submarines, the U.S. Navy’s Latest Annoyance

    April 2008 -
    The Navy in recent months has had to contend with several provoking episodes at sea — Iranian small boats speeding at its cruisers, destroyers and frigates; Russian bombers flying over its carriers; and Chinese subs shadowing its warships.

    Hard-to-detect submarines — such as quiet, diesel-electric boats — are particularly vexing, Navy officials say. They contend that an undersea arms race already has begun in the western Pacific.

    Nations there in recent years have begun to acquire stealthy diesel-electric submarines. Some of those nations, say Navy officials, could one day threaten U.S. access to strategic coastal areas of the world or interrupt the flow of commerce around the globe.

    Although the Navy has the world’s most technologically advanced fleet — including state-of-the-art nuclear attack submarines — officials acknowledge that these comparatively low-tech diesel-electric boats could give an enemy an asymmetric advantage.

    The beauty about a diesel submarine is that it has the potential to be far quieter than a nuclear submarine,” says Guy Stitt, president of AMI International, a Bremerton, Wash.-based company specializing in naval market analysis.

    Though they can’t travel long distances or sail very quickly, advancements in technologies, such as air-independent propulsion and fuel cells, have allowed diesel submarines to extend their operational ranges underwater.

    But perhaps their best selling point is their relatively inexpensive price tags. The Russians have sold diesel submarines for as little as $200 million and the French have exported their Scorpene submarines for $300 million.

    Israel Submarine Capabilities

    Israel was operating four, modern, diesel-electric Dolphin-class submarines in mid-2013.  The projected aim for the Israeli Navy (IN) was to increase its submarine numbers to six vessels operating from three home ports.

    The fourth and fifth submarines, agreed to in 2006, are advanced Dolphin-class vessels equipped with air-independent propulsion (AIP); the INS Tanin was delivered to the Israeli Navy in May 2012. The INS Rahav is scheduled to arrive in Israel sometime in 2014 after sea trials and weapons system integration. In February 2012, Germany and Israel also issued a contract for a sixth AIP-equipped Dolphin submarine, which is currently being constructed at the HDW shipyard. The German government is reportedly covering a third of the total $1.8 billion cost of the three advanced Dolphin-class vessels.

    The modernized Dolphin-class combines a conventional diesel led-acid battery system and an air-independent propulsion system (AIP) which makes the vessel extremely quiet and allows it to remain submerged for up to a week without surfacing. It is said to have a maximum speed of 20 knots, and a range of 4,500km. The new boats will be equipped with 650mm torpedo tubes—again leading to much speculation that the Israelis intend to outfit the submarines with nuclear-armed cruise missiles.

    Israeli submarine

    The sixth submarine, as yet nameless, will be added to the fleet in 2019 at an estimated cost of some $500 million – Israel's most expensive ever tool of war.

    By choosing (German-designed) diesel-electric Dolphin-class submarines, Israel can operate six submarines, which are quieter than nuclear-powered submarines, for a cost much less than a possible 3-4 billion dollars which the expensive nuclear option would entail.

    __________________
    Marty McFly:
    Does it run like on, on regular unleaded gasoline?
    Dr. Emmett L. Brown:
    Unfortunately, no. It requires something with a little more kick . . . plutonium!
  • 06-27-2015 09:55 AM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    Granted conventional submarines have a roll in some operational areas Smile

  • 06-27-2015 10:29 AM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    I still wont be buying an E Scooter and i have no use for a submarine

     

    riding for fun
  • 06-27-2015 10:58 AM In reply to

    Re: List of E Scooters

    Rod Fountain:

    I still wont be buying an E Scooter and i have no use for a submarine

     

    Me neither for my operational area Big SmileYes

  • 06-27-2015 11:43 AM In reply to

    Sad [:(] Re: List of E Scooters

    What sort of roll do they have?? Egg and lettuce, sausage, or maybe ham and cheese?? And a sub with a roll could be very dangerous for the crew.

     

    Carpe Diem
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