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Warranties - not all the same?

Last post 01-25-2008 07:54 AM by Anonymous. 15 replies.
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  • 01-23-2008 02:48 PM

    • shane
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 01-18-2008
    • Posts 7

    Warranties - not all the same?

    I have been reading with a lot of interest all the posts about the various scooters that are around, my original idea was to buy a nice Aprillia scooter as an introduction to scooters, but after a bit more research I see everyone raving about the Bolwell scooters.  Now the 4 year warranty sounds like a great idea, but my question is, what are the service intervals like?  I am assuming that they are some of the shortest intervals in the scooter world, when compared to other makes with shorter warranties.

    If this is so, then I would be avoiding them as much as I could, because you may get this good scooter at a good price, but the following service requirements would become costly.  So while everyone thinks that a 4 year warranty is because they must be brilliant scooters, in fact it has more to do with follow on costs that the owner will pay...that makes the dealers a lot of money?

    Its a bit like mobile phone shops in my mind.  they sell you a $800 phone for only $99 then without the consumer realising it the phone shop that sold you the phone collects a commission (services in scooters case) on every call you make while you are on the contract they signed you up to and with higher call (service in the scooters case) costs.

    It would be interesting to calculate the total running costs of two scooters, both the same size and initial cost to see what it really costs to own and run that scooter for say two years or say 15,000km.  I have a feeling that the models with the four year warranty would be significantly more expensive over this time frame, than the one with a one or two year warranty...

     

     

     

  • 01-23-2008 04:18 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    interesting topic. Manufacturers handbooks should have the servicing requirements/intervals within. I know that the intervals certainly vary from make to make. Perhaps readers could post the service schedule for their scoots?
    Vespa PX200 "Killer Wasp" - now on a street near you
  • 01-23-2008 04:34 PM In reply to

    • Tubsta
    • Top 25 Contributor
    • Joined on 08-22-2007
    • Secret Test Track, South Gippsland, Australia
    • Posts 1,192

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    Interesting question and you have a lot of great points.  I will add a reference to another thread http://www.scootercommunity.com.au/forums/p/1412/2593.aspx which also dug into this same question.   Basically, to keep a warranty valid, servicing needs to be performed by a licensed mechanic all through the warranty period, which costs money, which then costs more.  Bigger warranty on a cheap scooter can be a double edged sward.

    "Being cold is the result of laziness" - Bunta Fujiwara

    Current ride: Yamaha XT660Z Tenere.
    Gone: Piaggio MP3 400ie, too unreliable in the rain (think Italian electrics).

    ScooterZine
  • 01-23-2008 07:34 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    shane:
    Now the 4 year warranty sounds like a great idea, but my question is, what are the service intervals like?  I am assuming that they are some of the shortest intervals in the scooter world, when compared to other makes with shorter warranties.
     

     
    Your argument is perhaps a little simplistic,  lets look at some of the market leaders in Australia:

    Bug/Kymco:  4 year warranty, service interval 3,000km

    Bolwell:  4 year warranty, service interval 3,000 km

    Vmoto 12 month, service interval 4,000 km

    Vespa: 2 years, service interval, 5,000 km

    Yamaha: 1 year, service interval 4,000 km

    Please Note:   I relied on web searches to obtain the above information,  so I cannot guarantee the accuracy.  

     
    I believe that when considering service costs and warranty,  you also have to consider how many kilometres you travel,  if I am travelling 8,000km per year then after four years I will have done 32,000km,  say for the purposes of discussion the service cost is $120.00 per service (I'm not including tyres brake pads etc)

    The costs would be

    Bug/Kymco  10 services @ $120 = $1,200.00

    Bolwell 10 services @ $120 = $1,200.00

    Vmoto  8 services @ $120 = $960.00

    Vespa 6 services @ $120 = $720.00

    Yamaha 8 services @ $120 = $960.00

    On that basis there is only $480.00 difference between the cheapest and most expensive in servicing costs over 4 years,  to me the service cost verges on being irrelevant.

    In the case of the longer warranties,  if you did have mechanical problems in the 3rd or 4th year,  then the longer warranty would cover those repair costs and you would be in front when comparing total cost of servicing and repair versus the shorter warranties.

     

    EDIT:   When doing the research I found some scooter manufacturers have different service intervals for different models,  so if I found a manufacturer that had 2,500 services for some models and 4,000 services for others,  I used 3,000 as the interval instead of 3,250 etc, always going for slightly conservative numbers.

    Deklan 

    “It’s not the destination but the journey”
    Vespa GT200 in Grigio (Smokey Grey)

  • 01-23-2008 07:52 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    Good stuff, Deklan. I would also add that whilst servicing (by an authorised mechanic) costs money, it can mean you pick up on problems early (which is sort of the point) and therefore you can save money that way too.

    I know taxi drivers - or rather taxi vehicles - have the oil changed every 5,000Km to 10,000Kms and their engines last 500,000Km as a minimum. Servicing is good for reliability. 

  • 01-23-2008 08:57 PM In reply to

    • scootie
    • Top 500 Contributor
    • Joined on 01-20-2008
    • Melbourne
    • Posts 53

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    kiwiscoota:

    On that basis there is only $480.00 difference between the cheapest and most expensive in servicing costs over 4 years,  to me the service cost verges on being irrelevant.

    In the case of the longer warranties,  if you did have mechanical problems in the 3rd or 4th year,  then the longer warranty would cover those repair costs and you would be in front when comparing total cost of servicing and repair versus the shorter warranties.

    Well stated case for looking at the bigger picture.  4 year warranty is attractive on its own & as supported by your research, the longer warranty scooters are not hugely disadvantaged by more frequent servicing. A long warranty gives the consumer considerable piece of mind & better re-sale value if there is any remaining warranty & if it is transferable.

    Service costs are easy to budget for, unexpected major engine or trasmission repairs cannot be budgeted for.

    As your research clearly shows unless doing a high number of miles each year, the cost differential is minimal.

    Vespa GT60
  • 01-24-2008 09:44 AM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    scootie:
    Service costs are easy to budget for, unexpected major engine or trasmission repairs cannot be budgeted for.
     

    Agreed, and we all need to acknowledge the considerable cost saving of simply being on 2 wheels in the first place. Fuel, Rego, insurance, maintenance etc.... they all keep the moths safe in the wallet! I used to spend upwards of $1250 per service for a 4x4 I once owned that was plagued with problems, then needed new tires, and other $1000. The money servicing and keeping it on road, would have payed for close to a Fuocco over 4 years.

    We've gotta keep it real about costs of servicing a scooter, its damned cheap considering your options, a motor car. The more K's you commute in the scoot, the more you save on running cost of the family wagon. Just my 2 bobs worth.

  • 01-24-2008 11:17 AM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    Other things to consider too. 

    Firstly many of the new fuel-injected Vespa's, Piaggio's etc, the service interval is 10,000k. So find out the exact service interval for the vehicle, not just a suggested brand level one.

    Secondly, often the work associated with servicing a better quality scooter can be less than a cheaper brand, so the service cost CAN be lower. Though this will depend on the dealer - some of whom will charge more for a more expensive vehicle because its a more expensive vehicle.

    Thirdly, where the prescribed service interval seems too frequent, we will do a major service, followed by a minor service, so that we meet the warranty conditions, but don't do work where its not required just to make an extra buck.

    Fourthly, find a service that you can offer your dealer and get your servicing done for free.  Matt brings us packs of his own freshly roasted coffee beans on a regular basis, and he doesn't pay for his services at all Big Smile
     



    Ace Scooters - practitioners to the scooter addicted.

    www.acescooters.com.au
  • 01-24-2008 11:25 AM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    Steve! I'm a computer and web-site genius, can I have free servicing? :) hahahaha
    Vespa PX200 "Killer Wasp" - now on a street near you
  • 01-24-2008 12:18 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    JimmyLee77:
    Steve! I'm a computer and web-site genius, can I have free servicing? :) hahahaha
     

    And it seems extremely modest too  Wink

    Deklan 

    “It’s not the destination but the journey”
    Vespa GT200 in Grigio (Smokey Grey)

  • 01-24-2008 12:23 PM In reply to

    • shane
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 01-18-2008
    • Posts 7

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    Kiwiscoota, thanks for such a great detailed reply. awesome.  But I think Steve has a good point too.  Your examples are using the same service costs etc.  but in reality I wonder if it costs the same to service a Fly 125, as Steve would sell compared to a VS125, then also I wonder too if items such as brake pads and belt drives cost the same.  Then other points such as tyres....does a longer warranty mean that the maker will skimp on the quality of the tyres so that they only last 6,000kms compared to another models 10,000km.

    Although it might only cost say $500 to run one model compared to another over a period of 4 years, that $500 in itself is not great, but when compared to the investment in the scooter, it could be 20% extra cost and that as a comparison is quite a lot.

    Geez I am getting way to involved and over thinking about this now, hahahaha 

  • 01-24-2008 07:08 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    kiwiscoota:

    JimmyLee77:
    Steve! I'm a computer and web-site genius, can I have free servicing? :) hahahaha
     

    And it seems extremely modest too  Wink

    Was the "genius" bit going too far? *smirk*
    Vespa PX200 "Killer Wasp" - now on a street near you
  • 01-24-2008 07:37 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    JimmyLee77:
    kiwiscoota:

    JimmyLee77:
    Steve! I'm a computer and web-site genius, can I have free servicing? :) hahahaha
     

    And it seems extremely modest too  Wink

    Was the "genius" bit going too far? *smirk*
     

    Maybe something more modest like  I'm a computer genius and web-site guru  might have sounded more modest Cool

    Deklan 

    “It’s not the destination but the journey”
    Vespa GT200 in Grigio (Smokey Grey)

  • 01-24-2008 07:42 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    I'm happy with 2 years unlimited KM warranty with my Vespa. I figure, if something is going to go wrong with a scooter, it'll do it in the fist 6 months. Perhaps I'm wrong, but 24 months is a longtime, and unlimited KM's can be a fucken long way. 

  • 01-24-2008 08:24 PM In reply to

    Re: Warranties - not all the same?

    dozer:

    I'm happy with 2 years unlimited KM warranty with my Vespa. I figure, if something is going to go wrong with a scooter, it'll do it in the fist 6 months. Perhaps I'm wrong, but 24 months is a longtime, and unlimited KM's can be a fucken long way. 

     

    I think the most important aspect I was trying to point out was that long warranties do not necessarily mean huge service costs. 

    As Scootie said "the longer warranty scooters are not hugely disadvantaged by more frequent servicing"

    Personally,  I usually buy quality first, style/design second, warranty third, service frequency & costs fourth. 

    Reliability/quality is of more concern to me,  I can plan for services when convenient to me,  I cannot plan for unexpected breakdowns,  no matter whether they are covered by warranty or not.

    A good case for reliability is Scootanut's recent breakdown while she was away from her scoot arranging help,  her scoot was stolen.  Not only was the breakdown inconvenient, it probably was the main contributing cause of the theft.  Scootanut had already decided to trade her unreliable cheapish scooter in on a hopefully more reliable & quality built Piaggio Fly.

    Breakdowns rarely occur in convenient places or at convenient times and indeed can even put your life in danger (long story but a car breakdown that happened to me actually put my life in danger).

     

     

    Deklan 

    “It’s not the destination but the journey”
    Vespa GT200 in Grigio (Smokey Grey)

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